Once Upon A Film Industry

How to Find Success Outside Los Angeles with Len Gibson

January 31, 2021 Steven Lloyd Bennett and Al Lopez Season 1 Episode 11
Once Upon A Film Industry
How to Find Success Outside Los Angeles with Len Gibson
Show Notes Transcript

On this week's episode we have influential producer and filmmaker Len GIbson. He owns GoMedia productions and is the founder of the Peachtree Village International Film Festival in Atlanta. He talks to us about what's it like to find success in Hollywood without living there and the process of developing a film from script to distribution.

If you would like to submit to the Peachtree Village International Film Festival https://filmfreeway.com/PeachtreeVillageInternationalFilmFestival

For more info on GoMedia Productions: https://www.gomedia.productions/
Folow Len Gibson on Instagram @Len_Gipp


Welcome to once upon a film industry. I'm Steven Lloyd ennett. And I'm r Lopez. And we are here today with Mr. Len Gibson. How are you doing Le? Doing great. What's going on, guys? All right, man, welcome to the show. Len. Thank you. Thank you happy to be here. Len is a producer, filmmaker, overall, very influential guy. We're very, very glad to have him on board. And we're just going to jump right in. Where are you from? And how'd you get started in the film industry? Well, I'm from Atlanta, Georgia, originally, originally South Carolina, but I'm in Atlanta, about 16 years now. This guy started in the film industry, man, just just love for film and television, love for media started off in journalism, I, you know, received a journalism scholarship right out of high school, where to high point University, and, and got the film bug by taking you know, some classes, you know, I realized that I could do more, you know, with with a camera than even, you know, a pin in media. So, that kind of gave me more insight into the business. I did a few internships and the rest is history just kind of stayed in the film, the film part of business, I really enjoyed it along the way, Worked your way from the b ttom, basically. Oh, yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Nice. Is there a person that sort of inspired you, when you were going from journalism to film? You know, it's a lot of people have inspired me, I would say, to be honest, you know, I remember internship that I did in undergrad, I did an internship with Fox, a wg XP in high point, North Carolina, and a gentleman by the name of Timmy Hawk. You know, he told me that, you know, this was a business, obviously, that was hard. But he felt that, you know, with the right relationships, the tenacity, and obviously, the skill set, you can do well, but this just watching, you know, what he did with his career, although a different path that kind of just pushed me to, to want to do more. And, you know, from there, man, you know, it was Spike Lee was a major influence. I did my first internship outside of college, you know, I 40 acres of a mill. And just to watch, you know, spikes work ethic every day. at that particular time, he wasn't on set shooting film, but he was more in development, right, with projects that he was trying to get across the finish line, so that he could finance stuff and produce them. So I saw that side of the business. And at that time, that's what I really needed. I didn't know at that time, because when I was doing I was like, man, there's nothing going on. I mean, you know, but it was a lot going on, obviously, you know, trying to get those deals closed and done. So that was a major inspiration. For me. Being in the boardroom and hearing all those phone calls to go from New York to Hollywood, it really understanding you know, that process the business, it helped me along the way. So were you so did yo transition from North Carol na to New York? Yes, yes. So New York was the first doc correct? What was the most valuable thing that you took from them? The most valuable thing that I took is that you always have, you can't put yourself in a box where you're, you're working on one thing at one at one time, you got to have various things on the table, right? You can't have all your eggs in one basket. And the reason and the reason for that the reason I really learned that for spike is because at the time, he was working under Joe Lewis story, obviously, that film was never done. right up until today, at least not by Spike Lee. All right, he was working on rent the movie, obviously, that film ended up being directed by someone else. But those two projects were his babies at that time. And they didn't get done. Now. It was disappointing. Because you know, being in boardrooms and looking at storyboards and those types of things and saying, Wow, this joker story is gonna be great. But the fact that it wasn't that made me realize that Okay, one how challenging the business is. But two is that you got to basically be able to juggle and put more than one thing on the table at a time. The film that he ended up getting done during that time, or shortly after that time was inside man. Okay, so totally different. We saw the Inside Man script come in. And they were breaking it down doing all those things. But it was produced until a couple of years later. But the thing is, I was not even a project that we spent a lot of time working on. So that was a lesson learned, you know, and today in the business people asked me, What are you working on? I got like, 20 projects, because you never know which one's gonna hit first, you know? And speaking of like, you working on a bunch of different projects, you have NGO media, and you have a film festival. Can you talk about NGO media? And what kind of projects you guys work on? Yeah, so we go media go media is actually a young company, a little over a year old. But obviously, I've been in the business a lot longer than that. But we would go media. My business partner, his name is Wayne Overstreet, right. And, and Wayne and I work together off and on for about 10 years. And we saw an opportunity to come together to do something special here in Atlanta. At that time, you know, we've always talked about coming together and do something different than what we've done in the past. But we just thought the timing was right, when we notice a special article in the paper that came out in Atlanta and basically talked about how billions of dollars leave the state because post production wasn't being done in Atlanta. Okay. That was that was part of it. The first part, the other part of it was we realized that firms are not finance in Atlanta, right, firms always finance out of LA, or New York primarily, for the most part. So we looked at those two things we've like, what can we do as filmmakers, as seasoned filmmakers to change that narrative. And then a lot of the distribution deals are not getting done here, either. So we set out to form a company that can actually tackle all of those problems or issues, I should say that that plagued the Atlanta film business. And, and we went out, and we started looking for projects that we can keep here in the state that we can keep in the state of Georgia by being able to, at the very least manage the distribution, even if it can't be done, you know, in this state, at least have our company manage the process, if we start somewhere else we need to take apart or be a part of that distribution process to is basically helping these filmmakers raise financing for their film. And that's something that I've done, you know, my entire career, you know, help filmmakers raise financing for their projects. But we noticed a lot of times and consciously or unconsciously as to say, we haven't been really focused on the Atlanta or the state of Georgia film business as a whole, not saying that we're only working with, you know, Georgia filmmakers. But we know that that was a void that was left here in the state. So that was another thing just to start financing chrome or being a conduit to filmmakers, so they can get their films financed right here in our backyard. And then a distribution piece is that we've been really walking independent producers into distribution deals over the years. So why don't we start distributing films ourselves? Or why don't we even open the doors even wider for filmmakers to offer distribution opportunities. And that's where we actually formed another affiliate, global view entertainment, where we started distributing content. We did a film called followed in the summer, and they ended up being number one for two weeks in the in the box office. You know, and still out in the marketplace now. Basically, in the TV space, we that was our first foray. I can't explain the T the T bot space for listeners for transactional video on demand. So basically, when you go to Apple, iTunes, or Amazon or places like that, you can actually rent or buy the film. So follow. You know, for those that want to see it, they can go to Apple, iTunes, and rent it for like 399, right. And if they want to buy it, they can buy it for like 799 or 999. And same thing on several other platforms. But Apple, and Amazon been the top two. So that that was our first downstream from the theaters for that particular project. And our goal is to do several other films like That, you know, we can do a limited theatrical or even a broad theatrical release and, and taking it, you know, downstream through the transactional video on demand and through the subscription video on demand for places like Netflix or what have you. And just keep going well, we could do you know, well ourselves through self distribution. Nice, nice. And is there a type of film that go media attracts to what kind of film does go media like to do? You know, I'll tell you our passion is just, you know, strong stories that are family oriented. That's not passion, you know, films that the whole family can watch, right? But I will tell you that sometimes your passion is not necessarily what sells right in today's marketplace. Those are the prizes that we look for, you know, that we really like, as a company. But we do know that that action, heart comedy, you know, those are the firms that you know, that sell in today's marketplace. So we do, we do look for good action films, great storylines, obviously, great talent, we tried not to get too involved with development at this stage. Although if it's a project that we really, really like, you know, then we'll consider you know, developing the project as well. Right? So you take on projects that are already packaged and buy packaged. For our listeners, the meeting, you already have talent involved, that sort of thing? Or do you take it from the beginning, from script, we we do both, but I'll preface the projects that are already packed. So you would have, obviously your talent involved, your actors, you know, at least interested in the project. And you actually have a finance plan that that needs massage, if you will, and what I mean by that you may have one actor attached to the project, but you know, you need one or two others, you know, we will actually help with casting the right talent, and then taking that and packaging it with a sales agency that we're connected to, to get pre sales on the project, and just take it through that process for five years. So we prefer a package from, although it's a really, really great film, we'll look at, you know, from the development stage as well, too. And how do you find content? Um, honestly, you know, we've been doing this a long time. We don't, we don't necessarily look for content, for the most part, we probably get anywhere from six to eight projects a week, submitted, sometimes more. And about half of the projects are package and the other half is not. So we we get our hands on a lot of content. And it really just comes through producers and, and, and distributors, just different people that we've met over the years that we have relationships with. Nice. You say, when you say you get your hands on the content? Does that mean that people approach you guys as producible concept? You guys, hey, you know, this great writer, he's working on this piece? I have a name attached to it already. And then that's, that's how you get it? Or do they put it through a website? Yeah, no, it's normally they email us call us, you know, that type of thing. Normally, you know, or if it's a referral, you know, maybe it's a producer, as a friend, or even an actor that's just getting into producing and they know that what we do, and they reach out, and we talk so from there, you know, and how do you use the avenue of film festivals? You know, for film festivals? It's a couple of different things we do. We we do watch films that are frequent in the festival circuit. The fact that I that I'm producing a film, I'm going to film festival, obviously, we get a lot of films that come through my festival. But films that go through other festivals, a lot of times what happens they're all seeking distributors or additional financing, right, or combination of both sometimes. So the same thing, right? The producers of those films, they they cast a wide net reaching out to everybody just to see how they cannot get their film across the finish line. And a lot of times, you know, you have a steady list of producers that that attend a lot of these festivals. And then they will come back and say you know Lin Wang, you know, here five great films that I saw. That's looking for distribution. Can you take a look? Is there anything he can do? And then the list just keeps going on and on. I mean, it's a big industry, but at the end of the day, it's a small industry for individuals that are actually out there working and pounding the pavement every day. Right, right. And when it comes to your film festival, the Peachtree village International Film Festival, how'd you get that started? You know, the festival started through a really a conversation that I had with the gentleman by the name of Charles Johnston, he started an event. That's one of the largest events in the southeast is called the sweet arm and international Spring Festival. And, and with the sweet Arbor spring Fest, it attracts literally three to 500,000 people a year in Atlanta is pretty amazing. And he wanted to add a film festivals to the activities that he was doing with the spring fest. And coincidentally, I was already thinking about how to start a small festival in Atlanta for that. I frequent, a lot of film festivals over the years, speaking about independent filmmaking, and just go into festivals just enjoy. And sitting on panels and that type of thing, and actually just sitting in the audience, for other panels. And I noticed that a lot of festivals was providing a lot of things that filmmakers are not necessarily looking for. And and I don't necessarily mean that in a negative way. But what happens is, you go to a festival, sometimes you party, you have a lot of fun, but you leave. And you're in the same position that you were in when you went there. facts, facts, facts, and one of the things that that I thought that was definitely needed was a relaxed atmosphere where filmmakers can truly connect the dots with movers and shakers in the business. You know, the red carpet, the cold, all that other stuff is cool. But at the end of the day, like who are you actually connecting to? And are you feeling that relationship and that's something that we did, we created an environment that was easy enough for the average Joe to connect with a true mover and shaker in the business. And then on top of that, we also created an aspect of the festival that basically educates filmmakers about the history of film to help Usher them into the present. What I mean by that is we we actually, you know, started in the business with to travel and museums, and one African American cinema gallery, and Hispanic summer museum. And with that, with those two traveling exhibits, it's all about history. You know, learn the history of these filmmakers over the years and doing that. We were able to show filmmakers that 50 years ago, 100 years ago, I asked him to show or Melvin van Peebles or garden Park, so whoever did this, you can too. But these are the ways that you do it today versus then that type of thing. So those are aspects that we saw some brought to the festival that's a little different than most of our customers. And and when it comes to go media, how does your working relationship with Wayne Overstreet? Is it he does a certain thing, you do a certain thing? Or you guys just say there's let's just go like, how does that work? Well, it's we all understand our strengths and weaknesses, right? You know, like any other company. And there are a lot of things we do together. And there are things that he takes the lead or things that I take the lead on, you know, Wayne's background is in post production, anything that's post related, Wayne normally takes the lead or, you know, when there's something that's finance related, normally, I take the lead on, you know, so it's like that for the most part. And obviously, after working together, you know, for this length of time, you know, we're all learning other aspects of the business and using that as a tool, you know, as well. So we can be two three places at one time. Yeah, I'm interested in in more of the financing of the films, and the profitability that you're looking for out of film and your return on investment on the film is, does it normally take several years or what's what's your timeline for return on investment? Typically, for investors, it really depends on the flight and the finance plan, right? And then finance strategy where the project is very rare that you return on investment under a year with with the film. Normally, it's about a year and a half average. Some people will tell you two years, somebody will say three years. You know, it really depends on your finance strategy. I will tell you the strategy that we Use, we try to have all investors pay within a year and a half. But it does vary depending on the finest plan that's being utilized for sure. Your bases in Atlanta. Right? Yeah. What do you think the benefits of being in Atlanta is as opposed to being in LA? You know, Atlanta, I'll tell you is that it's, it's a different it's a different tack type of city, right. One, one of the great things is that I think a lot of people are more approachable, you know, here, which makes it a little easier, especially when you're starting out in the business. That, that makes it you know, it's a lot easier to, to connect with, you know, a will Packer in Atlanta versus, you know, going to LA and trying to connect with a producer that's doing rough producing work on that level, I think that's one of the advantages, I think of being in Atlanta. And also, the other thing I will say is that I think that there, you can, you can do things a lot less expensive. You know, in Atlanta, obviously, you know, the cost of living, so it's not that much less these days, but it is, you know, yeah, Atlanta is getting more and more expensive. But they are there are ways to get things done right, with less resources in a lab. And that's the that's the other thing. So I think, yeah, I think that those are the two things that that makes it a little different here. Do you think that if you were in LA, he would have more or less success? You know, I think about that all the time. I don't, I don't think it would be any different for me. I do a lot of business around the world. In fact, I probably do more business outside of Atlanta than I do in Atlanta. You know, today. I live here but la international business, you know, a lot of my business is done outside of the city, for sure. So you probably nowadays don't even need to be based in LA pretty much. No, not at all. Interesting. Would you say it's easier in Atlanta like to find actors, producers investors? what's what's your take on that compared to LA or New York? Um, you know, again, I think one of the things that makes it a little easier is that most of the individuals that it feels like we know everyone here now, I know we are I know. But the fact that I've been here so long, and it's uh, Atlanta is very cliquish, right? So if I'm not, if I'm not a part of a clinic, I know someone that is that I can reach pretty much anymore. So that makes it a little easier. I should say, like, if someone has financed the film in Atlanta, I'll probably know him like, a week, you know what I mean? Normally, and, and that, you know, it's it's a good thing, because, you know, movers and shakers are normally communicating with each other. And then other pieces is really, like I said, Atlanta is less expensive, in a lot of cases. So if something is being done for a million in LA, I can probably get it done for 700 in Atlanta, you know. And that's, and that's been, you know, a blessing over the years to to be able to do that. And the relationships again, just this the core relationships that I already have not even the new ones that I'm trying to gain or get is this is this man really, really good because we started out, I started out in business in Atlanta, the same time that that Tyler shot, Tyler Perry shot his first movie Diary of a man black woman, but also the same time that rain forest foams. Did you know one of their first movies, so that we were able to build a camaraderie in the business with with people that were doing that at a high level? Yeah, so that makes that made it a whole lot easier for me, and help, especially just just knowing who to call who to contact when I needed things. What's your sort of general advice for a young producer? They're focused on producing, they're fresh out of school, or maybe they're fresh out of some other thing they want to do they want to get into producing. What's your general advice for a young producer, or a new producer, basically for a young producer, my advice is really to, to get the education. And I'm not necessarily saying this from the classroom standpoint, but it's education and training, train and educate yourself as much as possible because this is just so super important to ensure that you're getting that knowledge, right, especially in the field. What happens is, you know, we, sometimes we go to the classroom, and we think that's all we need, right? Or sometimes vice versa, we go into fill in the blank, that's all you need it, you can't get enough for me. And pick up the books, read the books, but also get the hands on training. I tell all young filmmakers that it's so important, but then the other piece to it is network, you know, get outside of your bubble, you know, network work with other people. Even if it's volunteering on another set, I mean, you know, I am I work with a lot of young filmmakers, a lot of a lot of interns, especially through the film festival. And one of the things that I see, unfortunately, with this generation now is that we don't want to do the work. To be given everything, you know what I'm saying? I'm like, Who does that? Yeah, it's like, you go to you go to a thermostat, you want to be a director they want? You knows, like, what are you doing? You can't run the set, you know, it's like, you want to be paid. You know, what a director is being paid. It's like, you have zero experience. What are you doing? Yeah, it's like, you're too big to, to be a PA, you're too good to do this, like, come on, man, you got to do it all. It's like, it's not gonna work. If you know, you're in the wrong business. If you think you know, you're just gonna move up, just like that. It's just not gonna happen. And when it does happen, I mean, it happens very, very rare. You know, it's very rare. Right? Right. The dp I work with now talented guy. I am. When I first got to LA, I was like, man, I gotta meet people. So I went on a student film set as a PA, it was like a USC student films as a PA. Now I'm there. And I'm just like, kind of annoyed, because I'm like, Man, these students really know what they're doing. But I'm just trying to play the PA role. Just shut up, do my part, help where I can. And afterwards, I hired that dp and I was he was like, he thought I was a PA. So he was talking to me like, Yeah, what do you want? And I'll just, like, be my dp. He's like, Oh, okay. I didn't know I didn't know you. Yeah, so I definitely like I second that to what you're saying, like, go ahead and be on those sets that are kind of like, should I even be honest, go ahead and be on that set, because you're gonna learn, and you can connect, you can network with other people as much as possible. I have a question that's not necessarily about you. But I feel like it's about the environment and the climate that we're in right now. And I was watching, watching a bunch of shows on you know, Netflix, Hulu, apple, and all that stuff. And I feel like we're slipping into a black film and television, television, Renaissance or golden age or something like that. Do you? Do you agree with that? I do. I do. We are seeing a lot more black content out in the space today. And I think it's for a couple of different reasons. But regardless of the reason, I mean, it's a good it's a good time. It's a good season, you know, for for minority filmmakers in general. And we we have to take advantage of that. You know what I mean? Like, because it doesn't, it doesn't happen all the time. So we got to squeeze in where we can right now, what are you watching right now watch anything crazy, or good? You know, I watch a lot of different things. I mean, when people try to like figure out like, you know what genre like most when I tell them, you know the types of films and types of shows I watch. They're like, Whoa, okay, they're all over the place. You know, I watch. I watch shows like, I'm in I'm a Ozark fan. I was also I mean, this is another Netflix show under covers on the cover that was just started right? Yeah, well, this is the second season. Okay. What's that one about I never seen that one just saw it's it's about it's about undercover officers as this basically their life like you know, as undercover agents and storylines around that is pretty interesting. And it's far show. So but it's really it's really dope. Also, I do I do watch power like this. Um, and then I like the new show honor you, you know with Bryan Cranston on our show. Oh, that was started. Yeah, I think I saw the trailer. Yeah. Yeah, really good. second episode aired last night. Night, you just interviewed one of the writers for power, the Tommy spinoff blend? Tell me a little bit about some of the, what would you say is like the biggest challenge that you faced from when you started to where you're at right now? You know, the biggest challenge for me? As with a lot of a lot of minorities, I think the financial resources, just to be honest, you know? I mean, obviously, it changed over the years. But in the beginning now is that and the reason I say that is because I mean, there are only so many hours in the day, right? So what happens is you go out, and you try to find a nine to five. So to support yourself in the business. And there you you always want to do these projects, right, you have your own projects, your friends have projects, other people in the business app projects, and some people may have more resources than others. So they're shooting projects during the day, while you got to go work on work a nine to five, he can't really get the experience that you really want, because of finance or resources. So that's always been a challenge that thing, or is the challenge for a lot of people in this business is being able to support yourself as you're learning your training and, and trying to, you know, put yourself in a position where you can do a full time. So that's, that was, you know, definitely a hard challenge over the years, I think the match challenge is really, you got to kiss a lot of frogs before you find the right princess or you get to the right Prince princess or whatever, you know, whatever you. But the thing is this just like, for me, you run it to a lot of people that are faking it, you know what I mean? in this business? I'm sad to say, but it was like that, obviously in a lot of careers, right. But in this business, I mean, you know, it's Hollywood, so people are acting all the time, right? That's acting, and you don't know they're acting, you go down the wrong road for a very long time. And it hurts, you know what I'm saying? So yeah, those things that, that it's still difficult to this day, no matter how much experience you have, no matter how much you know, you gotta run into somebody that's you know, and you're you've got to be smart enough to protect yourself but now and to get away before they, you know, get their hooks into you. And that's, I mean, I just can't express that enough. It's challenging facts on that man facts on I feel like I've been down many Hollywood Road I call it being Hollywood, because it's happened several times to me. Yeah, it still doesn't matter man. It happens ultimately, though, I think those things toughen your skin and I feel like you need it. Because when I first started is it I mean, I'm from New York. And you know, I in grow I grew up pretty broke. So I knew what hardship was. So going into this industry, like getting smacked in the face a few times it was kind of like, Oh, I cuckoo and I just keep on going, you know, you take your day or two to lick your wounds, but then you keep on going. I feel like if you need them to toughen you up a little bit and to make you more secure and how you go forward. Yeah, you definitely definitely need it. You need it. There's no way you're gonna make it far without it. Alright, so we do this little thing with everybody it's like a we call it storytime is a simple story. Your craziest onset story wow was what was why do you want to know anyone that doesn't get anyone in trouble Okay, I you know, I can't tell you guys everything because I have to protect the innocent right right. Already guilty I should say right. The it's actually a series of things that happened on this one. I'm just gonna lump it all together guys. You know, we're working on a film number one the the gentlemen and bad Let's bring the silencer to the phone it was it was based on his his life. And he backed out like, literally, you know, 48 hours before production. And, and this is what you do not delay less than one take you that close to production don't have the money in the bank. I will say the reasoning, I will say this, this disclaimer on this thing was he had a local friend, that was financing as well. So we knew that we had a backup. And he was you know, he was good money up until that point. So we figured, hey, worst that can happen, you know, his friends not gonna let us say fall apart? Well, we have negotiate and close a new investor, literally less than 24 hours before the production. So I started off down the wrong road. Okay. Fast forward to the middle of the production, we still we didn't have enough money, you know, to finish the production. So we had to go find more money. Okay, and this is the this is the other thing was a nine day shoot. This is a feature film nine days, nine days. Okay, okay, so let the people know what a normal feature film is a normal indie feature film is what 1525 days something like? Yeah, exactly. You definitely don't want to go less than 15. But this was my days, okay. In this particular project, the number of locations, we I should have been 20 days. Okay, a lot of that. So I'm dealing with the craziness of the financing piece. But on top of that, you can imagine the hours that we were working every day. So what are the craziest things that happen was, we were supposed to shoot three locations one day sound sound easy, or not too bad. But these locations were like 45 minutes away in the city. Okay, so we're shooting at one location. And we were supposed to be done at that location, say around 6pm. We didn't get done until around 10pm. Okay, so the first first location, so we have to figure out how to split. So we can do the next two locations at the same time. So we did so we say one crew, one place or one crew together. Now the main location, because this is our last day with our main talent, we we

start shooting around 12:

30am you know, because we have to set up etc. Now the individual their own, the actual facility had to be at work at 5am. Okay, so you can imagine they're screaming at me, because they're like, I had to stay here. For the past six and a half hours. You guys are supposed to be here. And you're still in my facility. How long are you going to be anybody knows gonna take no less than three hours. So you can imagine how they're feeling they have to be there with us till 330 in the morning when they have to leave go to work at five. So all of that happening, and on top of that my crew was working 18 hours. Jesus, so they're just dead dead done. It was pretty rough. But we got the phone in the can we got distributed and we're making money on the project. But it's it was a it was a long, hard road with that particular project. Damn, that sounds like a movie in itself right there. Right. And it was a SAG project. Yeah, so what's on tap for 2021? Man, I know you say you got like a billion projects. Yeah, so we have a project called forget to remember with Kat Graham and Alex pettyfer that we're shooting and shooting January 11 here in Atlanta. So we're excited about that. And we also have a van Damme movie that we should have in Italy next month as well. We're kind of hands off on now when we helped raise some of the financing nouns called Deep six. My so those are two projects we have like right down and you know we we have a television project that we are shooting in January as well as kind of a one man show type deal. And that's it. I mean, those are the main things that are scheduled but several others in the works. Nice. Nice. Cool. So this is the last question I asked everybody. 40 years from now, you're an old man, you're looking back in your career? What makes you most proud? It's That's a hard question, I think is two different things, right? is really the curation of my traveling exhibits. You know, we we traveled the college circuit and just travel the world for about 12 years straight. So the people that we educated about the history of cinema, and it wasn't only about the history of cinema is basically educating people or inspiring people to live their dreams, regardless of how far fetched they may seem, right. So that was to me, very important. Something that I did, and then realize the impact that I was having on people. The other piece is really, phone festival. Um, not only the independent filmmakers lives that we change, you know, every year. But when you give, you know, someone like an Anthony Anderson or someone, you know, like, goodness, a Ruby, D, or any of these giants in the Business Award, and they say, this is the first award that I received of this sort, or this award means more than me, then, you know, NAACP award comedian, or whatever, those types of things, you know, I mean, a lot, because a lot of our heroes or a lot of our legends don't get the respect that they deserve, you know, when they're on earth facts. And those are things that we do at the festival, that that just, you know, make you proud. So, you know, 40 years from now, I will look back at that and say, You know what, I'm glad I did that. That's awesome, man. I feel like we've been doing this. You're the 13th or 14th person we're interviewing and everyone we ask always has something extremely meaningful. They talk about relationships, they talk about their impact on the world, they talk about how, you know, educating other others. They rarely ever talk about, like, I want to win an Oscar or they want they never say something that's like, like that, like a like a millionaire, like no one ever says that, which is always interesting to me. So I always ask that question. The fact that he said, you know, wanting to change lives, I mean, yeah, that's awesome. Yeah, I mean, cuz that's how you live forever. You know what I mean? It's like, that's used by someone else to do something, and they go out and actually do it. It was just one person, you know, your legacy lives. And that's, I think a lot of times, we forget that. That's why you know, teachers are probably you know, it's like the most underrated job in the world, because they're inspiring lives every day. Absolutely. Where can we find you? Or do you want to be found? I know some more importantly, is that that film festival Yeah, so the festival give you three different handles the festival is this at PV I FM. This was at the festival at PBI FF on all social media platforms and you know, the company go media productions. Is this at go media productions on all social media platforms? And me personally, i g i use Instagram more than anything now. So it's just lead underscore gift gi pp. Le, underscore gi pp. Well, thanks, man. I appreciate you. Guys, keep up the great work, Glenn. Thanks a lot. Now your true inspiration. Pretty say that we're gonna have fun and it's good to guess what you're doing. So thank you. If you want to submit to the Peachtree village International Film Festival, check the link in our show notes. If you liked this episode, and you're listening on Apple podcast, please leave us a review. And don't forget to check out our Instagram at once upon a film industry. Thanks for listening guys.